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Parachute Thingy
Topic Started: Apr 20 2010, 07:08:55 PM (1,895 Views)
Sword
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Kaz... I'm already half Xehanort
Granin
Apr 20 2010, 09:16:49 PM
Yeah, the story of Big Boss building Outer Heaven, let's just leave Outer Heaven and the building out of the mix.

Plus the fact you have Outer Ops and actually upgrading Mother Base in PW, it's 10000 better. It's worth that sacrifice by a mile.

Kojima has balls, that's why he's the best game designer ever - MGS2. If you're telling me that wasn't an experiment or a risk you're laughing, and that's your favourite MGS.
I think his point is that it doesn't have to be an element of the gameplay. Acquiring assets for Outer Heaven could be simply a part of the story and done in the cutscenes. It's another way they could've implemented it in Peace Walker but personally I'm fine with how it was done in the final product.
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freddiegibbs


Part of the story or not, it's a necessity for it to be included in the gameplay. It's like previous MGS games having no stealth gameplay.
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elephantinc
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Helikaon
Apr 20 2010, 09:14:42 PM
elephantinc
Apr 20 2010, 09:09:11 PM
You don't need to worry about this braking the fourth wall either because MGS had just never had one.
How in any way does it break the fourth wall? It's just a convenient new game mechanic.
If most things are believable and then you suddenly see something and think "yeah right, as if" you can temporarily stop believing in the game world and you lose any sense of immersion. The effect in this case would be minor, but I still felt it while playing the demo...
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NateDog
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We have arrived.
Selection for Societal Sanity
Apr 20 2010, 09:14:12 PM
I realize people thought it sucked recruiting in MGSPO, but here's a solution that doesn't break laws of space continuum and gravity.

Don't include the feature

MGS has never been about recruiting soldiers, atleast not the main ones, and what's up with gathering vehicles? Who cares, what's up with the fact that you can add colors and shit to the stuff you gather.
I suppose Koji's just trying to add different features to the game to make it different.

I myself hated recruiting in MPO also and never really found it useful, but then again I suppose it makes sense in regards to the story (building OH), but still the whole recruiting thing does feel a little out of place.
Watch this space.
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Sword
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Kaz... I'm already half Xehanort
elephantinc
Apr 20 2010, 09:42:05 PM
Helikaon
Apr 20 2010, 09:14:42 PM
elephantinc
Apr 20 2010, 09:09:11 PM
You don't need to worry about this braking the fourth wall either because MGS had just never had one.
How in any way does it break the fourth wall? It's just a convenient new game mechanic.
If most things are believable and then you suddenly see something and think "yeah right, as if" you can temporarily stop believing in the game world and you lose any sense of immersion. The effect in this case would be minor, but I still felt it while playing the demo...
That's not what "breaking the fourth wall" means.
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freddiegibbs


Nathan_snake
Apr 20 2010, 09:46:00 PM
Selection for Societal Sanity
Apr 20 2010, 09:14:12 PM
I realize people thought it sucked recruiting in MGSPO, but here's a solution that doesn't break laws of space continuum and gravity.

Don't include the feature

MGS has never been about recruiting soldiers, atleast not the main ones, and what's up with gathering vehicles? Who cares, what's up with the fact that you can add colors and shit to the stuff you gather.
I suppose Koji's just trying to add different features to the game to make it different.

I myself hated recruiting in MPO also and never really found it useful, but then again I suppose it makes sense in regards to the story (building OH), but still the whole recruiting thing does feel a little out of place.
In MPO yeah, but in PW. Outer Ops man, you can send your guys to fight battles and strategically fight with them, earning money which you can spend on weapons development, new parts to Mother Base etc.

The thing is it isn't compulsary and completely seperate unlike PO, you are given the choice. But I'm doing it all anyways.
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NateDog
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We have arrived.
Was that in one of the new trailers? If it was then sorry, I only watched I think the first 2 (and the Assassins Creed one) since I didn't want to watch the whole game through video and then play the same thing after already seeing it. :/
Watch this space.
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freddiegibbs


No worries son, I planned to stop watching them but you can only watch so much porn without needing a break really. :hmm:
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elephantinc
Light Infantry
Sword
Apr 20 2010, 09:46:34 PM
elephantinc
Apr 20 2010, 09:42:05 PM
Helikaon
Apr 20 2010, 09:14:42 PM
elephantinc
Apr 20 2010, 09:09:11 PM
You don't need to worry about this braking the fourth wall either because MGS had just never had one.
How in any way does it break the fourth wall? It's just a convenient new game mechanic.
If most things are believable and then you suddenly see something and think "yeah right, as if" you can temporarily stop believing in the game world and you lose any sense of immersion. The effect in this case would be minor, but I still felt it while playing the demo...
That's not what "breaking the fourth wall" means.
No, no it doesn't
My mistake. :blush:
Sorry.
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freddiegibbs


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Selection for Societal Sanity
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Granin
Apr 20 2010, 09:16:49 PM
Quote:
 
I suppose Psyco Mantis is perfectly feasible too?
Grey fox? Nothing wrong with that.
Stealth suits? Ok.
Since when has MGS been feasible?
You don't need to worry about this braking the fourth wall either because MGS had just never had one.


I guess the fulton recovery is breaking rooves though.


Quote:
 
I realize people thought it sucked recruiting in MGSPO, but here's a solution that doesn't break laws of space continuum and gravity.

Don't include the feature

MGS has never been about recruiting soldiers, atleast not the main ones, and what's up with gathering vehicles? Who cares, what's up with the fact that you can add colors and shit to the stuff you gather.

Why not just skip that part all together, it's not like it adds to the gameplay. Kojima probably put in some "trading" feature too, I'm not sure of this but I do remember reading in an interview way back that his son did not like MGS and that he wanted to create a portable game where people could play together at school, or where ever they are.

Kojima you fucking genius (I mean that, no sarcasm) why do you have to experiment on MGS? Is he affraid it won't sell otherwise? Why does he have to do everything in MGS, why can't he do other projects and experiment with this trading stuff, why make MGS about that?


Yeah, the story of Big Boss building Outer Heaven, let's just leave Outer Heaven and the building out of the mix.

Plus the fact you have Outer Ops and actually upgrading Mother Base in PW, it's 10000 better. It's worth that sacrifice by a mile.

Kojima has balls, that's why he's the best game designer ever - MGS2. If you're telling me that wasn't an experiment or a risk you're laughing, and that's your favourite MGS.
Kojima does have balls. And yeah I realize the whole Outer Haven thing is importaint. But Big Boss wasn't the main guy behind it, amirite?

correct me if I'm wrong but unless MGSPW's story is about Outer Haven the gameplay is kind of irrelevant. I do not know much of the story. But lets say it doesn't focus too much on Outer Haven, then... The idea of the recruiting wouldn't really mean much.

Maybe they could've made it so that others recruited soldiers. Afterall the main boss of big companies or anything like that isn't the guy that goes around and make sure people gets jobs at his company, he has others doing that. Maybe BB likes to get his hands dirty, lol.

They could've made the whole recruiting a subplot or a side mission type of deal, a thing you weren't forced to do. But if it does have a huge impact on story then I guess it's a must.
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freddiegibbs


Selection for Societal Sanity
Apr 20 2010, 10:09:44 PM
Granin
Apr 20 2010, 09:16:49 PM
Quote:
 
I suppose Psyco Mantis is perfectly feasible too?
Grey fox? Nothing wrong with that.
Stealth suits? Ok.
Since when has MGS been feasible?
You don't need to worry about this braking the fourth wall either because MGS had just never had one.


I guess the fulton recovery is breaking rooves though.


Quote:
 
I realize people thought it sucked recruiting in MGSPO, but here's a solution that doesn't break laws of space continuum and gravity.

Don't include the feature

MGS has never been about recruiting soldiers, atleast not the main ones, and what's up with gathering vehicles? Who cares, what's up with the fact that you can add colors and shit to the stuff you gather.

Why not just skip that part all together, it's not like it adds to the gameplay. Kojima probably put in some "trading" feature too, I'm not sure of this but I do remember reading in an interview way back that his son did not like MGS and that he wanted to create a portable game where people could play together at school, or where ever they are.

Kojima you fucking genius (I mean that, no sarcasm) why do you have to experiment on MGS? Is he affraid it won't sell otherwise? Why does he have to do everything in MGS, why can't he do other projects and experiment with this trading stuff, why make MGS about that?


Yeah, the story of Big Boss building Outer Heaven, let's just leave Outer Heaven and the building out of the mix.

Plus the fact you have Outer Ops and actually upgrading Mother Base in PW, it's 10000 better. It's worth that sacrifice by a mile.

Kojima has balls, that's why he's the best game designer ever - MGS2. If you're telling me that wasn't an experiment or a risk you're laughing, and that's your favourite MGS.
Kojima does have balls. And yeah I realize the whole Outer Haven thing is importaint. But Big Boss wasn't the main guy behind it, amirite?

correct me if I'm wrong but unless MGSPW's story is about Outer Haven the gameplay is kind of irrelevant. I do not know much of the story. But lets say it doesn't focus too much on Outer Haven, then... The idea of the recruiting wouldn't really mean much.

Maybe they could've made it so that others recruited soldiers. Afterall the main boss of big companies or anything like that isn't the guy that goes around and make sure people gets jobs at his company, he has others doing that. Maybe BB likes to get his hands dirty, lol.

They could've made the whole recruiting a subplot or a side mission type of deal, a thing you weren't forced to do. But if it does have a huge impact on story then I guess it's a must.
A = Outer Heaven :P

B = Yes, the story is about BB going all nuts and making Outer Heaven.

C = It's all well and good not to like it (but not really) but it is completely optional. You can play the game through classic style too. Whether you like the controls or not you have to admit the level design is some of the best the series has seen.
Edited by freddiegibbs, Apr 20 2010, 10:15:14 PM.
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Selection for Societal Sanity
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Heavily-Armed Trooper
I was gonna say earlier that the level design looked pretty interesting.

Well I'm happy if I can skip the whole recruiting part, because I'm not interested in that
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Doakes
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Selection for Societal Sanity
Apr 20 2010, 09:14:12 PM
Don't include the feature

MGS has never been about recruiting soldiers, atleast not the main ones, and what's up with gathering vehicles? Who cares, what's up with the fact that you can add colors and shit to the stuff you gather.

Why not just skip that part all together, it's not like it adds to the gameplay. Kojima probably put in some "trading" feature too, I'm not sure of this but I do remember reading in an interview way back that his son did not like MGS and that he wanted to create a portable game where people could play together at school, or where ever they are.
You seem to be forgetting one very basic fact about this era of MGS, it's Big Boss, not Solid Snake. Big Boss is recruiting well rounded soldiers for MSF and eventually OH, he's physically rounding up an entire army and convincing them to join his cause, captivating them and giving each and every soldier a reason to fight for themselves versus manipulating them the way Gene did.
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Weedle_McHairybug
Hi-Tech Soldier
BigK
Apr 21 2010, 12:24:01 AM
Selection for Societal Sanity
Apr 20 2010, 09:14:12 PM
Don't include the feature

MGS has never been about recruiting soldiers, atleast not the main ones, and what's up with gathering vehicles? Who cares, what's up with the fact that you can add colors and shit to the stuff you gather.

Why not just skip that part all together, it's not like it adds to the gameplay. Kojima probably put in some "trading" feature too, I'm not sure of this but I do remember reading in an interview way back that his son did not like MGS and that he wanted to create a portable game where people could play together at school, or where ever they are.
You seem to be forgetting one very basic fact about this era of MGS, it's Big Boss, not Solid Snake. Big Boss is recruiting well rounded soldiers for MSF and eventually OH, he's physically rounding up an entire army and convincing them to join his cause, captivating them and giving each and every soldier a reason to fight for themselves versus manipulating them the way Gene did.
Don't forget Zanzibar Land. Another thing of note is that he's also trying to avoid what the Patriots often used Soldiers as (if you watch the Codec conversation between Raiden and JD, JD basically implied that Soldiers were, to the Patriots or at least to it, essentially weapons and tools to be discarded or destroyed once they no longer served any use.).

Also, if Big Boss ever encountered Commander Red from Dragon Ball, he'd DEFINITELY object to his methods (if you have ever watched the Red Ribbon Army Saga of Dragon Ball, you'll understand why.).
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Helikaon
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Hate to nitpick, but Raiden doesn't speak to JD. That AI is unnamed in the actual games, but is named as JFK by the script.
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Roy
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I wont deny that I am a bad boy =)
Quote:
 
Kojima you fucking genius (I mean that, no sarcasm) why do you have to experiment on MGS? Is he affraid it won't sell otherwise? Why does he have to do everything in MGS, why can't he do other projects and experiment with this trading stuff, why make MGS about that?

lol this isn't Madden 2010.
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Jack Reacher
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Seeing as you cant drag enemies bodies thanks to the PSP's controls, i dont really mind that you can use it indoors, its kinda convenient. And do go on about a games laws, especially in MGS. The Fury turning into a fireball once you kill him, The Pain turning into bees and teleporting, psycho mantis etc etc, all this stuff breaks physics so if you cant enjoy this kind of stuff and play for FUN then I actually recommend against getting the game and watching the story on youtube or something
This statement is unprovable.
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hukibeast
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I think S3 is getting at is that balloons flying through ceilings is more lazy than fantastical. It's not their to be mysterious or interesting, like the Cobras, it's their because they couldn't find a way around it.

His opinion, not mine.
Language isn't your first language is it? -Metal_girl_Solid
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Sword
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Kaz... I'm already half Xehanort
Jack Reacher
Apr 21 2010, 01:58:14 AM
Seeing as you cant drag enemies bodies thanks to the PSP's controls, i dont really mind that you can use it indoors, its kinda convenient. And do go on about a games laws, especially in MGS. The Fury turning into a fireball once you kill him, The Pain turning into bees and teleporting, psycho mantis etc etc, all this stuff breaks physics so if you cant enjoy this kind of stuff and play for FUN then I actually recommend against getting the game and watching the story on youtube or something
Sorry, just to point out (weather I agree with Selection for Societal Sanity's posts or not) I don't see this as a valid argument. I would ignore it if it was used once but several people say these things. Totally different/unrelated issues.
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