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Chico in TPP (Ground Zeroes Spoilers)
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Topic Started: Apr 2 2014, 07:43:53 PM (29,398 Views)
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blindfox
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Jun 19 2015, 02:48:33 AM
Post #641
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That ^^^
GZ made me actually like his character after hating on him in PW. But still, I'd prefer he'd be killed off from that copter crash because his death could really weigh heavily on Big Boss' plunge into madness.
- NovaZero
- Oct 4 2014, 04:13:05 PM
My theory is that Chico escapes the helicopter crash since he betrayed Big Boss. And in order to survive he will have to disguise himself and hide. And he will re-join Big Boss later as Decoy Octopus. Decoy Octopus was the oldest member of Foxhound in Shadow Moses. And Chico would be 43 in Shadow Moses and since the other members of Foxhound were either in their 30's or 20's, it would make sense.
He might not re-join Big Boss as Decoy Octopus as it might be an obvious plot twist for us, but I do believe Chico will become Decoy Octopus. Really like this idea, especially if he survived the crash. And I'm one of those guys that occasionally hates it when characters are recycled.
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Eagle
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Jun 19 2015, 08:05:32 AM
Post #642
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Heavily-Armed Trooper
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- angryification
- Jun 18 2015, 11:34:28 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't survive the helicopter crash. With the nails in his feet and Kaz, Big Boss and the medic probably seriously injured, who could help Chico?
How about the surviving MSF soldier that Chico was comforting?
- blindfox
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- NovaZero
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My theory is that Chico escapes the helicopter crash since he betrayed Big Boss. And in order to survive he will have to disguise himself and hide. And he will re-join Big Boss later as Decoy Octopus. Decoy Octopus was the oldest member of Foxhound in Shadow Moses. And Chico would be 43 in Shadow Moses and since the other members of Foxhound were either in their 30's or 20's, it would make sense.
He might not re-join Big Boss as Decoy Octopus as it might be an obvious plot twist for us, but I do believe Chico will become Decoy Octopus.
Really like this idea, especially if he survived the crash. And I'm one of those guys that occasionally hates it when characters are recycled.
I actually just recently posted on Reddit a theory about it. Let me post it here, along with another theory I really liked. Also, spoilers for the MGSV E3 2015 trailer:
Chico is Decoy Octopus Okay, so first I'd like to say there is no evidence to back-up this up and this is all speculation based on the themes of The Phantom Pain. And no, this is not a joke theory, this is a serious theory.
I know that there is a possibility that Chico is dead, but I don't (want to) think so (and am in extreme denial).
Let me start with the recent E3 2015 trailer. We know that Kojima occasionally drops subtle hints in his trailers, like with the Sins of the Father/E3 2013, where the lyrics were lined up in a manner that revealed the true nature of the characters. So in this recent trailer, we start with Skull Face and Zero talking about his past and it says "as a young boy he lost his native language, the bedrock for any developing child. His country, his family, his face, his identity-everything was stolen from him." And then we cut to possibly Chico's cassette and to a shot of the vision of the third man in the hospital who could quite possibly be Chico. All these things make think that they're setting up Chico (along with Big Boss) as a parallel to Skull Face since these things could be attributed to Chico as a child (not to mention that Skull Face, who stole all these things, could be said to be looking to create someone just like him):
-Loss of country (MSF/MotherBase/Outer Heaven being destroyed and possibly being unable to return to Nicaragua)
-Loss of family (His father killed in PW, Paz, the girl he loves, dead, MSF, his extended family, destroyed, Big Boss, his new father figure, in a coma, and Amanda possibly abandoning/disowning him)
-Loss of his face (Possibly being disfigured in the resulting helicopter crash/possibly disfiguring/mutilating/reconstructing his face after the crash/facial reconstruction as Ishmael, assuming Ishmael isn't a product of Big Boss' imagination)
-Loss of identity (Breaking from tortured at the hands of Skull Face in Camp Omega, being forced to rape Paz, the destruction of MSF and the death of his compas, all weighing on his conscious, causes Chico to reassess his identity as a man, soldier, comrade, and friend)
All of this causes Chico to conclude that he may not be soldier material. However, he still decides that he will bring down Skull Face/XOF and Cipher the same way they brought down Paz, Big Boss, and MSF-through lies, manipulation, and deceit (Words That Kill).
Now, I know this may have nothing to do since Acid is probably non-canon, but in it, Decoy Octopus is stated to be Mexican, which could easily be retconned to another country in Central America such as Nicaragua.
The trailer also touches on the theme of race and identity as an individual, which Decoy Octopus may not even have because he can be and might want to be anyone except for himself, which with Chico could be caused by guilt of what he did in Ground Zeroes and what it resulted in. Now let's assume Chico is the third man at the hospital and Ishmael and that all this is true, it may explain why Ishmael is hesitant to tell Big Boss who he is, because he wants to escape his identity.
Big Boss: "Who are you?"
Ishmael: "Me?" Looks away in guilt "(Hesitantly) I...Looks back I've been watching over you for 9 years. You can call me Ishmael."
And finally, the theme of language, which is said to be important for leaders, civilizations, and Skull Face's goal being to eradicate it-Sans Lingua Franca. With Decoy Octopus, it could be stated he doesn't have a Lingua Franca since he is fluent in over a dozen languages and is pretty much a human translator, setting up a parallel to Skull Face's, and by extension, The Phantom Pain's, language theme. Besides, assuming Chico is Ishmael, and that he has been at the hospital for 9 years, that wouldn't give him much to do aside from possibly learning languages, mimicking people, and learning about medicine.
Lastly, I just want to note that E3 trailer kinda hints at characters that are predecessors, allusions, connected, or even are the characters in Metal Gear Solid:
Quiet-Sniper Wolf (Middle-Eastern Snipers)
Eli-Liquid (Same person)
Skull Face-Decoy Octopus (Master of disguises and manipulation with no race or identity)
"Huey" Emmerich-Hal "Otacon" Emmerich (Father-Son)
Ocelot-Revolver Ocelot (Same person)
Code Talker-Vulcan Raven (Native American Shamans)
Those Who Don't Exist-Psycho Mantis (Possibly the same person, being creations of another)
Lastly I'd just like to add that I hope this theory is not true, although it is much better than Chico being dead. I much prefer the other theories, like Chico being the Raiden of The Phantom Pain, among others, and I don't want Chico's role to be extended beyond The Phantom Pain, with him dying at the end and being happily reunited with Paz in the afterlife.
And the one I much prefer, which Shrederator over at Reddit came up with, and the one that is mine, which I may add to more later:
Chico is the "Solid Snake/Raiden" of MGSV: TPP and a parallel to both Skull Face and Big Boss Okay, so my part is the following. I really hope Chico is in the game, and a critical player at that. I know there is a strong possibility of him being dead, but I think that Kojima actually can't show him because he may be really important and revealing him would spoil a major plot-point in the game.
In fact, knowing Kojima and how he adds subtle hints in his trailers, I think (want to believe) that he was hinting at Chico (alongside Big Boss) being a parallel to Skull Face in that instant in the trailer where they are talking about how Skull Face as a "young boy [losing] his native language, the bedrock for any developing child. His country, his family, his face, his identity-everything was stolen from him" - Cut to a shot of possibly Chico's cassette and to the vision of the third man in the hospital who is quite possibly Chico. Chico pretty much experienced the same things as a child in Ground Zeroes and somewhat in Peace Walker. I think (want to believe) that, very much like Big Boss, Chico will be a parallel to Skull Face and Kojima can't reveal him yet.
I've been saying this time and again that Kojima is going to pull a Raiden on Chico. I mean, Kojima seems to have put a lot of focus on building Chico's character in GZ, as well as emphasizing his and Paz's relationship and making him fit the theme of revenge. Now the way I see this working out is in two ways.
1. Chico grows up being obsessed with getting revenge on Skull Face at all costs for Paz and MSF.
2. Chico grows up wanting revenge for Paz, but grows to become very much like Snake was before TPP and Solid Snake, and thus refuses to go as far as Snake is willing to go for the sake of revenge, causing potential conflict between the two.
With the way Kojima built Chico up in GZ, to me it would possibly be the biggest waste of opportunity in MG to kill such a character off. Another reason I think Chico may not have been shown yet is because maybe he's too important to the plot, and his reveal might spoil something major about TPP.
A theory I had is that Chico might be the final boss of The Phantom Pain. Ok, just hear me out. Since Big Boss will become more villainous throughout the game and it will ultimately end with Big Boss becoming the antagonist we meet in Metal Gear, it would be a nice way to show how far he's fallen.
Chico will oppose Big Boss' ways and cruelty, and the two will have a battle. Ultimately, Big Boss wins, pointing his gun at Chico, who is on his knees and hands, mirroring the scene in Peace Walker, where Big Boss makes makes Chico hombre nuevo. Only this time, Chico will say that someone else will rise to stop Big Boss and "Shoot. You will only kill a man." And this time, Big Boss actually pulls the trigger, completing his transformation.
Metal Gear Solid V started with the heroic Snake rescuing Chico, and it will end with the villainous Big Boss killing Chico. And the player has to be the one to pull the trigger, like in MGS3.
And finally, Shrederator's theory which I really like:
Chico is the "Moby Dick" of MGSV: TPP The white headphones which are the exact same model Chico had in Ground Zeroes pulled out of the African's neck? The fact that Paz has possibly been cloned? That big boss listens to a recording "From the Man who Stole the World" on the exact same model Walkman that Chico had in a white room? All this leads me to believe that Chico's role in TPP will be huge, possibly even being one of the main antagonists. I personally believe he is the 'Moby-Dick' in this story, the very thing Ahab (Big Boss) in hunting. That fact his earphones were plugged into his chest in Ground Zeroes, I know this sounds a little crazy, but they could symbolize a blow-hole, the thing whales use to breathe. The whiteness of the headphones and the room which Big Boss listens to the tape which I believe is by him I think is also symbolically referring to him. These could all be non existent straws I'm pulling at here but I do believe that his role will be huge and he is being purposefully hidden. I have a feeling he joined Cipher, since at the sink where Big Boss plays the recording, the FOX logo can be seen on a black box.
The reason I pointed out the whiteness of the room and headphones was because the whale in Moby-Dick is remarkably white, I forgot to mention this. Here's something else to chew over. In Ground Zeroes, Chico's real name is revealed to be 'Ricardo', a small detail that is never brought up again. I know Kojima is very purposeful with the names of his characters, Eli and David come to mind, and I think this is the same for Chico. Ricardo is the Spanish form of the English name Richard. What is a common nickname for people named Richard? Dick, 'Moby-Dick'. If I turns out he is dead and not in the game, I will be so upset, because the possibilities for his character are endless.
The second I saw that Walkman, I thought the voice overs where a purposeful parallel to the tragedy of the character Chico. In Moby-Dick, the whale is noted to be incredibly cut-up and scarred from all the harpoon attacks carried out on him that never managed to kill him. Perhaps Chico is badly scarred by the helicopter crash, paralleling Skullface. (Also, on the bench in the white room, among the remnants of bullet heads, casings, pills and blood, you can also see the same medical scissors used to open up Paz's wound. I don't know if this is a purposeful call back to Paz's operation or referring to the Medic character, but I see that character as a red-herring by Kojima to throw us off. I feel like Kojima is teasing Chico's presence or maybe I'm going insane the more I think about it. I can't tell)-Although be noted that these were are incredibly important events to Chico.
Edited by Eagle, Aug 8 2015, 07:19:02 PM.
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FalcoPelle
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Jun 19 2015, 09:39:12 AM
Post #643
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Light Infantry
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great post eagle
Chico is a perfect "nine years watcher" but Joakim and Kojima wore his mask... why? there's a deeper meaning... has Kojima a particular preference
blow hole... great, so Chico used this method on other people? Does he work with skullface? But skullface seems hallucination...
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Metal Gear Planet
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Infiltrator
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Jun 19 2015, 09:46:58 AM
Post #644
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I hate those "everyone is decoy octopus" theories as much as the next person, but I've always thought of Chico being decoy octopus as possible. All the member of FOXHOUND were connected to big boss in some way. We know how for all of them now (even vaguely like psycho mantis) except for raven and decoy octopus.
EDIT: The only problem I have with him being Ishmael is that he doesn't have an accent like Chico did.
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- Mr. Gibbs
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I hope we all die. - Max Payne
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You stop right fucking there and apologies Infiltrator . CIA is many things; a has been meme master, a baneposter who ran it to the ground so bad to where it stopped being funny, a complete and utter podcast tsundere but I will NOT allow you to call him a shitty Gary Stu who killed a 7 part book series. That's just mean and unfair.
Sorry if I sound angry but this was too much, even with the strike in mind.
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Eagle
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Jun 19 2015, 09:59:14 AM
Post #645
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Heavily-Armed Trooper
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- Infiltrator
- Jun 19 2015, 09:46:58 AM
EDIT: The only problem I have with him being Ishmael is that he doesn't have an accent like Chico did. Easily explained. Either
A) He does have an accent and Kiefer Sutherland just voiced Ishmael at GDC to cover the otherwise obvious fact that it is Chico.
B) Chico has already started mimicking people and is mimicking Big Boss' voice to protect him as a safeguard should he need to stay behind and try to cover for him temporarily as a decoy.
C) 9 years in a hospital in an English colony with various accents and languages, especially English with British accents, caused him to lose the accent.
Edited by Eagle, Jun 19 2015, 05:06:19 PM.
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Infiltrator
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Jun 19 2015, 10:12:47 AM
Post #646
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- Eagle
- Jun 19 2015, 09:59:14 AM
- Infiltrator
- Jun 19 2015, 09:46:58 AM
EDIT: The only problem I have with him being Ishmael is that he doesn't have an accent like Chico did.
Easily explained. Either A) He does have an accent and Kiefer Sutherland just voiced Ishmael at GDC to cover the otherwise obvious fact that it is Chico. B) Chico has already started mimicking people and is mimicking Big Boss' voice to protect him as a safeguard should he need to stay behind and try to cover for him temporarily as a decoy. C) 9 years in a hospital in an English colony with various accents and languages, especially English and British caused him to lose the accent. Ok I can see those as possibilities. I'm still leaning more towards Ishmael being a hallucination, but I'm not ruling out him being Chico.
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- Mr. Gibbs
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I hope we all die. - Max Payne
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You stop right fucking there and apologies Infiltrator . CIA is many things; a has been meme master, a baneposter who ran it to the ground so bad to where it stopped being funny, a complete and utter podcast tsundere but I will NOT allow you to call him a shitty Gary Stu who killed a 7 part book series. That's just mean and unfair.
Sorry if I sound angry but this was too much, even with the strike in mind.
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blindfox
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Jun 19 2015, 10:35:22 AM
Post #647
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Warning: NSFW
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- Infiltrator
- Jun 19 2015, 09:46:58 AM
I hate those "everyone is decoy octopus" theories as much as the next person, but I've always thought of Chico being decoy octopus as possible. All the member of FOXHOUND were connected to big boss in some way. We know how for all of them now (even vaguely like psycho mantis) except for raven and decoy octopus.
EDIT: The only problem I have with him being Ishmael is that he doesn't have an accent like Chico did. It's said Raven was an Outer Heaven soldier in his earlier days, although I'm not sure how canon that is exactly.
As for Ishmael, I'd much prefer if Ishmael was simply a Tyler-Durden like hallucination. It's just way more interesting to me that way. With Kiefer voicing him as well, and how Skull Face's appearance in the latest trailer implies hallucinations will be occurring, I'm more in favor of Ishmael being a phantom.
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big_boss1988
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Jun 19 2015, 10:39:31 AM
Post #648
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I Am The Hype
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Chico is dead. Plot twist.
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MGSF PEACE
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FalcoPelle
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Jun 19 2015, 10:45:38 AM
Post #649
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Light Infantry
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but he's the perfect "him"
"what about him?" Kaz doesn't say his name because that kid is a traitor
why so much time spent of "Big Boss teachings" around this character to let him die in a simple crash..
he's a traitor that watch big boss for nine years to remedy his sins
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big_boss1988
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Jun 19 2015, 10:56:21 AM
Post #650
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I Am The Hype
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Do you entrust a traitor with watching your leader?
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CIA
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Jun 19 2015, 10:57:30 AM
Post #651
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- big_boss1988
- Jun 19 2015, 10:56:21 AM
Do you entrust a traitor with watching your leader? Didn't he betray his sister and her soldiers in PW as well? I wouldn't want him on my team.
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 Departed: I hate MGS 1 because I'm old.Forum Bling
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big_boss1988
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Jun 19 2015, 11:03:44 AM
Post #652
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I Am The Hype
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Yeah, nobody likes a snitch. But gotta face the fact that he's just a kid in the end.
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Infiltrator
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Jun 19 2015, 11:09:58 AM
Post #653
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Yeah I mean I think he means well, but he betrays people out of fear.
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- Mr. Gibbs
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I hope we all die. - Max Payne
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You stop right fucking there and apologies Infiltrator . CIA is many things; a has been meme master, a baneposter who ran it to the ground so bad to where it stopped being funny, a complete and utter podcast tsundere but I will NOT allow you to call him a shitty Gary Stu who killed a 7 part book series. That's just mean and unfair.
Sorry if I sound angry but this was too much, even with the strike in mind.
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FalcoPelle
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Jun 19 2015, 11:13:19 AM
Post #654
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you're right... but nobody ordered him to watch the leader
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blindfox
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Jun 19 2015, 11:15:52 AM
Post #655
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- FalcoPelle
- Jun 19 2015, 10:45:38 AM
why so much time spent of "Big Boss teachings" around this character to let him die in a simple crash..
he's a traitor that watch big boss for nine years to remedy his sins He may have betrayed Big Boss yet again, but Big Boss still gave a shit about the kid beyond security reasons. Paz was the main target in GZ because she was their only link to Cipher. Chico, at the point, was literally useless to MSF. He could've just let the kid die there in his misery. Everything they needed to know about Cipher or Skull Face would've been drawn from Paz.
Having Chico die serves a greater purpose than having him live to avenge Paz: it adds a significant weight, due to their bond with one another, to the anvil thats going to drag Big Boss down from the sky. And at this point there's absolutely nothing thats gonna convince me that Chico is Ishmael, or that Ishmael is even real. I've never heard of any injury, with maybe the exception of leprosy skin disorder (although I'm not knowledgeable in that department), that requires wearing bandages over the course of 9 entire years of rehabilitation.
If nothing else, with Big Boss in a coma, I'd bet all my money that Kaz wouldn't have let the kid live.
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big_boss1988
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Jun 19 2015, 11:19:59 AM
Post #656
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- FalcoPelle
- Jun 19 2015, 11:13:19 AM
you're right... but nobody ordered him to watch the leader
You think they'll leave him there and trust that he wouldn't compromise BB's safety?
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FalcoPelle
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Jun 19 2015, 11:26:00 AM
Post #657
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ok blindfox thx (but reguarding bendages there's no evidence he has them since 9 years, maybe 5 minutes before)
big boss_1988 right.. don't know what to say in fact at least Ocelot knows everyone in that hospital..
at this point... speaking about another character turning around hospital: "a rival living a lie"
Ocelot always survives, he's onniscent in a certain way during every chapter of this saga
Ishmael is the only Moby Dick survivor and a narrator
Ocelot helps Big Boss escape from the hospital and he's a sort of guardian angel...
could he be the 9 years guardian? "that woman? we gave her a light" "who am I? mmmh You can call me Ishmael"
also in the phantom pain he's gonna exit unscathed, no real phantom pain for him, no bloody hand like others
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Metal Gear Planet
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FalcoPelle
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Jun 19 2015, 11:30:45 AM
Post #658
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uff double sorry
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Infiltrator
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Jun 19 2015, 11:36:34 AM
Post #659
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But why would Ocelot bandage himself up and try to hide his identity from big boss only to show himself moments later?
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- Mr. Gibbs
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I hope we all die. - Max Payne
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You stop right fucking there and apologies Infiltrator . CIA is many things; a has been meme master, a baneposter who ran it to the ground so bad to where it stopped being funny, a complete and utter podcast tsundere but I will NOT allow you to call him a shitty Gary Stu who killed a 7 part book series. That's just mean and unfair.
Sorry if I sound angry but this was too much, even with the strike in mind.
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andreasps4
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Jun 19 2015, 11:45:35 AM
Post #660
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I can't understand why ocelot is described as " rival " he works for BB and Kaz during the phantom pain events right?
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