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Ishmael - Character Thread; All things Ishmael
Topic Started: Apr 8 2014, 02:21:30 AM (1,571 Views)
Shinobi2014
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Am I the only one who thought that the character Ishmael is a trailer only/exclusive character and he will be removed in the final version of the game? Big Boss might escaped from the hospital in some other way or without help and go on only on his own.
Edited by Shinobi2014, May 3 2014, 01:46:51 PM.
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Trigsby
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Shinobi2014
May 3 2014, 01:46:18 PM
Am I the only one who thought that the character Ishmael is a trailer only/exclusive character and he will be removed in the final version of the game? Big Boss might escaped from the hospital in some other way or without help and go on only on his own.
Yeah your probably the only one.
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Heisenberg
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Lol ^^

So to the dude who knows "for a fact" the medic is Ischmael, care to enlighten us?
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steeleman
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Inspector_Swag
May 3 2014, 08:30:01 PM
Lol ^^

So to the dude who knows "for a fact" the medic is Ischmael, care to enlighten us?
Meaning I'm 99% sure. It just adds up to make sense. I don't really agree with other people's theories and crap but that YongYea guy actually got something to a T that I agree with. It's no different then other people believing Eli is Liquid. That adds up and makes sense as well.
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genjy
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DMFox
May 1 2014, 09:55:53 PM
DaPhantomSnake
May 1 2014, 09:52:39 PM
Ok here's my crazy Outlandish preposterous conspiracy theory!!! The Bandaged Man is Big Boss And the person that is waking from the coma is a Man named Ishmael. Who is in fact a clone of Big Boss. The Genome Soldier Clone. The first of the genome soldiers that would later be used during the shadow Moses incident. And I think Big Boss need him alive so he can form the basis of Big Boss's new unit the Diamond Dogs. We play the entire game as Ishmael. The forgotten clone!!!!! And Ground Zeroes is a virtual reality simulation that was used to make Ishmael believe he was Big Boss meanwhile everybody thinks Ishmael is the real big boss when in fact he is just a clone and the Real Big Boss is in the shadows looking for a way to kill Zero. I really wouldn't put it past kojima to do something this outrageous considering he replaced snake with raiden in mgs2. Hopefully I'm wrong about it but something tells me we are not going to be playing as Big Boss in TPP
Body double, VR theory...

You really want a game about the downfall of BB to be a VR simulation experienced by someone else? A "random clone" who is of no importance to the story?

This is meant to be how BB falls to "the dark side". And you want that to be the cause of someone elses actions? not BB's own psychological downfall? The WHOLE point of the game?
I can't say I agree with the whole body double theory, but what irks me is that body double theory detractors would often mention that MGSV is supposed to be some kind of "the fall of Big Boss" game.

Why does Big Boss have to become evil? Why can't we have both good Big Boss and bad Big Boss? The bad Big Boss in MG1 and MG2 could be a clone who has been brainwashed to think he is Big Boss. It's not out of the question in terms of story-telling and what's possible in the MG universe.

Has Hideo made some kind of promise that he is going to turn John/Jack into an evil MF?
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Oblivious
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Some funny user posting ridiculous things about the viability of currently discussed theory in 3... 2... 1...
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abstract-one
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genjy
May 3 2014, 08:57:30 PM
DMFox
May 1 2014, 09:55:53 PM
DaPhantomSnake
May 1 2014, 09:52:39 PM
Ok here's my crazy Outlandish preposterous conspiracy theory!!! The Bandaged Man is Big Boss And the person that is waking from the coma is a Man named Ishmael. Who is in fact a clone of Big Boss. The Genome Soldier Clone. The first of the genome soldiers that would later be used during the shadow Moses incident. And I think Big Boss need him alive so he can form the basis of Big Boss's new unit the Diamond Dogs. We play the entire game as Ishmael. The forgotten clone!!!!! And Ground Zeroes is a virtual reality simulation that was used to make Ishmael believe he was Big Boss meanwhile everybody thinks Ishmael is the real big boss when in fact he is just a clone and the Real Big Boss is in the shadows looking for a way to kill Zero. I really wouldn't put it past kojima to do something this outrageous considering he replaced snake with raiden in mgs2. Hopefully I'm wrong about it but something tells me we are not going to be playing as Big Boss in TPP
Body double, VR theory...

You really want a game about the downfall of BB to be a VR simulation experienced by someone else? A "random clone" who is of no importance to the story?

This is meant to be how BB falls to "the dark side". And you want that to be the cause of someone elses actions? not BB's own psychological downfall? The WHOLE point of the game?
I can't say I agree with the whole body double theory, but what irks me is that body double theory detractors would often mention that MGSV is supposed to be some kind of "the fall of Big Boss" game.

Why does Big Boss have to become evil? Why can't we have both good Big Boss and bad Big Boss? The bad Big Boss in MG1 and MG2 could be a clone who has been brainwashed to think he is Big Boss. It's not out of the question in terms of story-telling and what's possible in the MG universe.

Has Hideo made some kind of promise that he is going to turn John/Jack into an evil MF?
Because it would be stupid not to, most everyone likes a good 'breaking bad' type story - where events warp a person in to becoming a monster, where the decisions a person makes send them on a perilous slope towards evil.

Big Boss was the villain of the original Metal Gear games for NES, he was a war mongering maniac who exploited children. While its possible those games will be retconned, and they probably will to some degree, BB's change in character is something that should not be retconned. We've been patiently watching his slow character development expecting it. He is the main character, as Kojima has said. In writing you typically want your main character to change over time and be shaped by traumatic/dramatic events, not remain stagnate.

Notice the strong (its hard not to) anti-torture message of Ground Zeroes. And what do you see Big Boss and his associates doing in the Red Band trailer? Torturing Huey and Quiet, who are most likely innocent of whatever they are being suspected of. Quiet will probably live up to her namesake, and not say anything even in torture - making the audience sympathize with her. Torture is among the things Big Boss and Kaz will resort to, as they are so consumed by a drive for revenge. It makes for an interesting and dramatic story. Its because that is what the trailers are teasing will happen. 'In Outer Heaven, Men Become Demons' and 'Kaz, I'm already a demon'. MGSV originally had the code name Project Ogre.

Having a clone or body double be the bad guy really fucking cheapens it, and its completely unnecessary. Not to mention there are enough Snakes running around in the series already. Any fourth clone or someone who even is made to look like Big Boss, reads like poor fan fiction.
Edited by abstract-one, May 4 2014, 01:27:12 AM.
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Oblivious
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abstract-one
May 3 2014, 09:24:34 PM
reads like poor fan fiction.
MGS4... Good old times.
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Rogue Agent
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Kojima already stated/implied that this game will be the fall of Big Boss.
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I <3 TOKUGAWA HEAVY INDUSTRIES - credit goes to Tollhouse and Snake Eater
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Black Adder
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Was it here that I saw someone posting something from the lyrics of Not Your Kind Of People about becoming a horrible person in a dream who builds an army of people you shouldn't rely on, over top of images of Mother Base, child Soldiers and Big Boss lying on the hospital bed in his coma? May have been elsewhere but it made perfect sense with the pictures attached.
Edited by Black Adder, May 4 2014, 04:03:37 AM.
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AbudJasemAlBaldawi
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genjy
May 3 2014, 08:57:30 PM
Why does Big Boss have to become evil? Why can't we have both good Big Boss and bad Big Boss? The bad Big Boss in MG1 and MG2 could be a clone who has been brainwashed to think he is Big Boss. It's not out of the question in terms of story-telling and what's possible in the MG universe.

Has Hideo made some kind of promise that he is going to turn John/Jack into an evil MF?
Ummm, yeah.

Kojima: MGSV is the story of how Snake became Big Boss, an evil threatening the entire world
Edited by AbudJasemAlBaldawi, May 4 2014, 04:48:09 AM.
You too have known loss, and that loss torments you still. You hope hatred might someday replace the pain, but it never goes away.

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Gaseous-Snake
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I think maybe the medic is Ishmael and he will allude to this fact at some point. He will probably show up in other forms throughout the game but then at the end it will turn out that he never actually existed and we will get a montage of Big Boss doing loads of miraculous shit when the odds are stacked against him.
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steeleman
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The other reason why I think the Medic is Ishmael is because from a plot standpoint it's only Kaz, (possibly Chico) and Big Boss himself who survived MSF's downfall. If the Medic is Ishmael then he would symbolize the "last of his kind" and whether he's real or not it would make sense to the story.
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Gaseous-Snake
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Imagine it turned out that many of the MSF soldiers were actually clones of Big Boss :o
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d3m01iti0n
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Gray Fox. Called it. Hes the 80s Raiden for Big Boss. Expect to play a pre-cyborg Frank Jaeger DLC.

He infiltrated Mother Base under Snakes nose, working in the Mess Hall.
Edited by d3m01iti0n, May 10 2014, 06:44:45 AM.
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Trigsby
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Don't fight it.
Theres always Morpho :haha:
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Zan Datsu
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Get up & Go

Trigsby
May 10 2014, 04:22:06 PM
Theres always Morpho :haha:
2 Morpho's :D
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Until that diamond nipple awesome game is ever created, all we can do is dream that one day, an MG1 remake happens
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Trigsby
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Don't fight it.
Who is the real Morpho? Is there a body double? Is Morpho even real?

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Heisenberg
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It's the helicopter pilot.
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Trigsby
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Don't fight it.
Was kidding jeez
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