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MGO3 (Pre-BETA) Feedback; Post here for the L.A. developers!
Topic Started: Dec 22 2014, 02:49:34 PM (20,739 Views)
(SGR) SEAN
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Dive Bombing Eagles
CherryCoke
Mar 5 2015, 05:32:24 PM
Zan Datsu
Mar 5 2015, 05:25:06 PM
CherryCoke
Mar 5 2015, 05:13:31 PM
Oh really, like what?
Classes, XP, seeing through walls, marking, etc.

Like said, i will wait for the beta before i judge but im very skeptical at this point. We need more infos !!
Apart from classes, we had all of that in MGO2. And why is there a trend against classes now? Do players not want to conveniently save and then return to their favourite set-ups? Maybe we should totally randomize the set-up you'll get on each spawn. That would make it even more inconvenient, perfect.
Mgo2 had skill presets for each game mode, just as good as classes.
MY THOUGHTS ON THE CURRENT STATE OF MGO3: http://youtu.be/jOp3qaK7S5k Posted Image
My Youtube Channel. http://www.youtube.com/user/TheOuterGaming
My PSN - SGR_SEAN_
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Frank Underwood
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Vanilla Coke is better. I'm the shite one.

(SGR) SEAN
Mar 5 2015, 06:16:57 PM
CherryCoke
Mar 5 2015, 05:32:24 PM
Zan Datsu
Mar 5 2015, 05:25:06 PM
CherryCoke
Mar 5 2015, 05:13:31 PM
Oh really, like what?
Classes, XP, seeing through walls, marking, etc.

Like said, i will wait for the beta before i judge but im very skeptical at this point. We need more infos !!
Apart from classes, we had all of that in MGO2. And why is there a trend against classes now? Do players not want to conveniently save and then return to their favourite set-ups? Maybe we should totally randomize the set-up you'll get on each spawn. That would make it even more inconvenient, perfect.
Mgo2 had skill presets for each game mode, just as good as classes.
And classes are the logical progression of that. There's no issue here.

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(SGR) SEAN
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Dive Bombing Eagles
No thats just a restriction of player choice its a regression not a progression
MY THOUGHTS ON THE CURRENT STATE OF MGO3: http://youtu.be/jOp3qaK7S5k Posted Image
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Frank Underwood
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Vanilla Coke is better. I'm the shite one.

(SGR) SEAN
Mar 5 2015, 06:34:44 PM
No thats just a restriction of player choice its a regression not a progression
Not really, it just forces player to do the choosing before a game starts.

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(SGR) SEAN
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Dive Bombing Eagles
But with classes its pre determined, not player driven.

You cant have a medic bag as an engineer in battlefield.

In mgo there were no restrictions, skills were simply specializacions in certain actions.
Edited by (SGR) SEAN, Mar 5 2015, 07:26:08 PM.
MY THOUGHTS ON THE CURRENT STATE OF MGO3: http://youtu.be/jOp3qaK7S5k Posted Image
My Youtube Channel. http://www.youtube.com/user/TheOuterGaming
My PSN - SGR_SEAN_
My Twitch. http://www.twitch.tv/outergaming
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Frank Underwood
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Vanilla Coke is better. I'm the shite one.

It allows for a lot more varied ways of playing to be balanced.

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(SGR) SEAN
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Dive Bombing Eagles
Classes are far from balanced. In fact you run into more problems with balancing classes then leaving it open for players to experiment.
Edited by (SGR) SEAN, Mar 5 2015, 07:01:19 PM.
MY THOUGHTS ON THE CURRENT STATE OF MGO3: http://youtu.be/jOp3qaK7S5k Posted Image
My Youtube Channel. http://www.youtube.com/user/TheOuterGaming
My PSN - SGR_SEAN_
My Twitch. http://www.twitch.tv/outergaming
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Rikitatsu
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Hi-Tech Soldier
CherryCoke
Mar 5 2015, 05:13:31 PM
Rikitatsu
Mar 5 2015, 05:04:02 PM
CherryCoke
Mar 5 2015, 04:55:47 PM
(SGR) SEAN
Mar 5 2015, 04:41:36 PM
CherryCoke
Mar 5 2015, 04:35:24 PM
Natural but not reasonable.
Yea but considering the goals these people are trying to reach with mgo3.
Like it being a bigger success, how do they expect to reach that by just being like the rest and not offering much new.
People will play mgo3 just to check it out but mgs5 will be the main attraction, so how do they expect to get peoples attention, and keep their attention with these bad design choices, it will last a year at best, and get shut down in the second, at the rate their going, thank god they still have time to prove me wrong but they have yet to prove other wise

I want mgo3 to be successful because i dont want it to be shut down again, and last longer, but when i see stuff like thins it concerns me, konami wont waste their time keeping the servers up if it fails and a majority of the player base leaves within a year.
From what I've seen, MGO3 looks like something very new. I'd like to know where you've seen other online games like it. And what are these bad design choices?

And I doubt the servers will close in two years. The whole point of MGO3 is to appeal to a wider audience. That and they probably have decent servers now instead of that Konami ID rubbish. It'll probably be around for a while.

Rikitatsu
 
t's perfectly reasonable to ask for those features back, even if the developers tells us it's going to be a different game.
It's MGO3, not a spin-off or new IP, it carries a legacy and expectations on it's back.

More so when these demanded features are significantly better than what they seem to be doing right now.

No it's not reasonable. Kojima has been telling us for years that MGO3 will be different from MGO2. It will appeal to a wider audience. That and MGSV is supposed to be a pseudo-reboot for the series. It's losing old features and gaining new ones. Forcing Kojima to do specific things with his games because he did them in previous ones is what has held MGS back as a whole for a long time.
Again, just because the developer says a game will be different doesn't mean it's unreasonable to demand change. It doesn't exempt the developer from criticism.

Games shouldn't "lose features and gain new ones" because fuck all. They lose features when there is a better alternative. What they seem to be doing right now is introducing inferior system to that of it's prequel.
Not all stealth multiplayer should be the same. This is like asking Call of Duty to become Counterstrike. MGSV is going in a new direction, not all directions require the tight competitive multiplayer that was MGO2. It isn't the only legitimate form of multiplayer.
If Call of Duty 1 was like Counter Strike then it's reasonable for fans to ask the developer to bring the superior features and systems back in the sequel.

The best feature about MGO, a staple the series had from the beginning: Custom Games/Server Browser, is likely missing from MGO3. It's something that brought the community together, allowed for both casual and competitive rooms, and gave the players freedom to customize their matches and create new rules. If such a system is absent, people are expected to voice their complaint and it's not unreasonable to do so just because the developer is saying it's gonna be different.

Quote:
 
Not really, it just forces player to do the choosing before a game starts.

If you think that's the only limitations the class system has then you haven't thought this through.

In MGO2, you can create your own character, wear the uniform you want, choose the set of skills you want, and use the mix of weapons and gadget you want.

If MGO3 uses a conventional class system, you won't have such freedom. As skills, weapons, gadgets, and cloths are tied to certain classes.
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Frank Underwood
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Vanilla Coke is better. I'm the shite one.

So you're saying a franchise has to stay exactly the same forever? That's bloody stupid

And the classes shown in MGSV do allow different uniforms. And classes do indeed make balancing better if you're going to be bringing in features like stealth camouflage. You can't just implement that feature and not restrict the play in some other way. It would just be poor balancing.

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Rikitatsu
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CherryCoke
Mar 5 2015, 08:05:35 PM
So you're saying a franchise has to stay exactly the same forever?
What? No.
Franchises should evolve, and not devolve.

Quote:
 
And the classes shown in MGSV do allow different uniforms.

You missed the point.

Quote:
 
And classes do indeed make balancing better if you're going to be bringing in features like stealth camouflage. You can't just implement that feature and not restrict the play in some other way. It would just be poor balancing.

Balance can be implemented through various ways that aren't a class system. For example, Overpowered skills like CQC-EX in MGO took 4 slots, that's a restriction.
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Frank Underwood
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Vanilla Coke is better. I'm the shite one.

Rikitatsu
Mar 5 2015, 08:14:01 PM
CherryCoke
Mar 5 2015, 08:05:35 PM
So you're saying a franchise has to stay exactly the same forever?
What? No.
Franchises should evolve, and not devolve.
They shouldn't devolve, but they don't need to evolve. MGSV is a new branch, going off in a different direction. Just because it's a bit more casual doesn't mean it's less legitimate.

Rikitatsu
 
Balance can be implemented through various ways that aren't a class system. For example, Overpowered skills like CQC-EX in MGO took 4 slots, that's a restriction.
And classes encompass weapons and skills. I don't see why Kojipro needs to reinvent the wheel.
Edited by Frank Underwood, Mar 5 2015, 08:23:55 PM.

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(SGR) SEAN
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Dive Bombing Eagles
Re invent the wheel?
They already did with mgo1 and 2 but better.
MY THOUGHTS ON THE CURRENT STATE OF MGO3: http://youtu.be/jOp3qaK7S5k Posted Image
My Youtube Channel. http://www.youtube.com/user/TheOuterGaming
My PSN - SGR_SEAN_
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Rikitatsu
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CherryCoke
Mar 5 2015, 08:23:30 PM
Rikitatsu
Mar 5 2015, 08:14:01 PM
CherryCoke
Mar 5 2015, 08:05:35 PM
So you're saying a franchise has to stay exactly the same forever?
What? No.
Franchises should evolve, and not devolve.
They shouldn't devolve
And that's exactly what MGO3 is looking like right now, a devolution.

Quote:
 
Just because it's a bit more casual doesn't mean it's less legitimate.

Accessibility is a great thing.
Accessibility at the cost of great game systems and elements is definitely not. That's bad design.

Quote:
 
And classes encompass weapons and skills. I don't see why Kojipro needs to reinvent the wheel.

I don't understand why you continue to miss the point. Let me explain:
For example. what if you want to choose a sniper rifle, and tranquilizer gun, a C4, equip the quick recovery skill + runner skill, and wear a neat looking bulky armor. In MGO2, you could do that. You can basically create your own custom class.

In a conventional class system, this isn't possible. If you want to use a Sniper Rifle, you must choose the scout class (for example) that doesn't come with C4s, quick recovery skill, nor a neat bulky armor.

You see how it offers less freedom now?
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Frank Underwood
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Vanilla Coke is better. I'm the shite one.

Rikitatsu
 
Accessibility is a great thing.
Accessibility at the cost of great game systems and elements is definitely not. That's bad design.
It would be a bad thing if it was supposed to be an evolution, which it isn't. It is build from the ground up, different.

Rikitatsu
 
I don't understand why you continue to miss the point. Let me explain:
For example. what if you want to choose a sniper rifle, and tranquilizer gun, a C4, equip the quick recovery skill + runner skill, and wear a neat looking bulky armor. In MGO2, you could do that. You can basically create your own custom class.

In a conventional class system, this isn't possible. If you want to use a Sniper Rifle, you must choose the scout class (for example) that doesn't come with C4s, quick recovery skill, nor a neat bulky armor.

You see how it offers less freedom now?
And why is less freedom bad?

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Rikitatsu
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CherryCoke
Mar 5 2015, 08:43:25 PM
Rikitatsu
 
Accessibility is a great thing.
Accessibility at the cost of great game systems and elements is definitely not. That's bad design.
It would be a bad thing if it was supposed to be an evolution, which it isn't. It is build from the ground up, different.
It would be a bad thing regardless.
Also, the developers themselves disagree with you.

Posted Image

Quote:
 
And why is less freedom bad?

Not inherently bad, but a devolution from the previous system. In other words, a step down.
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Frank Underwood
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Vanilla Coke is better. I'm the shite one.

"Not inherently bad, but a devolution from the previous system. In other words, a step down." Bad if it was trying to be the old MGO, which it isn't.

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Rikitatsu
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CherryCoke
Mar 5 2015, 09:05:31 PM
Bad if it was trying to be the old MGO, which it isn't.
As a sequel, it's trying to build upon it's predecessor. So replacing great systems with vastly inferior ones is, without a doubt, bad.

Also, are you still going to say the developers aren't trying for an MGO experience even after I posted that tweet above? They are pretty much saying they are not actively trying to make a different game, and they intend to build and improve upon the previous games.
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Frank Underwood
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Vanilla Coke is better. I'm the shite one.

They have told us time and time again that they are westernizing the game. So it isn't that strange that they are implementing more western features.

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Rikitatsu
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CherryCoke
Mar 5 2015, 09:26:53 PM
They have told us time and time again that they are westernizing the game. So it isn't that strange that they are implementing more western features.
Discarding Free Lobbies and having Automatching only is a "western feature"? Western or Eastern, it's a massive stepdown. And people are not being unreasonable for voicing their complaints.
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JJJ_
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There Is Only Darkness
The people complaining about the gameplay of MGO3 don't seem to realise that the primary goal of the developers is to create a multiplayer mode for MGSV, not a sequel to MGO2. The same way it was with MGO2. The main game comes before the last iteration of the multiplayer.
I once wrote something in the shoutbox. This was the response.
A prominent member whose name I can't remember
 
Who are you?
ZhasCOME2, on an MG and MG2 remake:
Quote:
 
If someone like myself were to remake it, It would be an awesome game.
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