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MGO3 (Pre-BETA) Feedback; Post here for the L.A. developers!
Topic Started: Dec 22 2014, 02:49:34 PM (20,752 Views)
Rikitatsu
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Dec 26 2014, 11:24:25 AM
Class system increasing teamplay. I cant understand what they're going for, chose your role, support the team. MGO2 was plagued with alot of one man running and gunning. Of course with roles there must be a ton of stuff that is also incoming, i'm guessing maybe a few more vehicles and an engineer class of some sort.
I don't get it.
Are you saying using a Class system compels people to play different roles? Because it doesn't. At least, not any more than MGO2's system.

Just as a lot of people used Ar2, Run2 in MGO2, a lot of people will stick with the 'Assault' class or whatever they might cook up.

MGO2 was completely customizable, you can create your own class (Pre-Sets) with your special mix of skills and uniforms. It's a fantastic system.
Edited by Rikitatsu, Dec 26 2014, 12:06:41 PM.
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Solidus Reborn
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Rikitatsu
Dec 26 2014, 12:06:08 PM


MGO2 was completely customizable, you can create your own class (Pre-Sets) with your special mix of skills and uniforms. It's a fantastic system.
Perhaps this is exactly what they will do and just call it a 'class system'. Id like this.

Dyanmic leveling:
- Being able to go up and down in level was great. It kept you playing at your best, and leveling up was rewarding! You also knew who the best players were...because the level was pretty damn indicative of the player's skill
Edited by Solidus Reborn, Dec 26 2014, 02:21:29 PM.
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_se7en_
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Dec 26 2014, 12:36:14 PM
Rikitatsu
Dec 26 2014, 12:06:08 PM


MGO2 was completely customizable, you can create your own class (Pre-Sets) with your special mix of skills and uniforms. It's a fantastic system.
Perhaps this is exactly what they will do and just call it a 'class system'. Id like this.

Dyanmic leveling:
- Being able to up and down in level was great. It kept you playing at your best, and leveling up was rewarding! You also knew who the best players were...because the level was pretty damn indicative of the player's skill
exactly! you said it better than me. That's why the De-levelling system is so important!

I don't even understand the concept of levelling up just by playing for an extended period of time. That prestige level bullshit of gamesl like COD and so on have zero credibility.
Now in MGO, if you saw someone level 17 or higher you knew he was a great player (when it wasn't boosted , of course)


@ Dredargon: there were no unlockables at higher levels. The equipment (weapons) was the same wether you were a level 0 or a level 20, it was all just a matter of your own skill and performance in a match and that's why MGO was(and would still be) light-years ahead of every online shooter there is.

As for gear, it was a matter of reward points, which were earned by playing Survival, Tournaments and automatching.

Edited by _se7en_, Dec 26 2014, 12:46:09 PM.
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Zan Datsu
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Deleveling was good but it caused alot of rage between players.
Edited by Zan Datsu, Dec 26 2014, 01:04:03 PM.
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_se7en_
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Rage and stupid people are in every game out there, unfortunately. There is nothing developers can do to stop that kind of people from entering their games so we might aswell keep the de-levelling system and stay with a good and engaging system.

I wouldn't mind if they get rid of GP though (i liked it but people started worrying too much about GP, and forgot about teamwork, even between clanmates)
Edited by _se7en_, Dec 26 2014, 01:23:30 PM.
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DrEdArgon
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Dec 26 2014, 12:45:28 PM
@ Dredargon: there were no unlockables at higher levels. The equipment (weapons) was the same wether you were a level 0 or a level 20, it was all just a matter of your own skill and performance in a match and that's why MGO was(and would still be) light-years ahead of every online shooter there is.

In that case I wouldn't have a problem with having that system in MGO3 since leveling up doesn't unlock anything and doesn't mean anything - just shows how well you have played overall.
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Danne Smeed
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Dec 23 2014, 06:56:01 PM
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Dec 23 2014, 04:53:12 PM
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Dec 23 2014, 04:38:19 PM
The free battle lobby, where if you make a custom game it automatically switches to unranked
Worst idea I've seen in a long time.
What if you prefer to only play custom or to do so most of the time?
Then the stats wouldn't be close to accurate. This would only strengthen elitism like people who play alot of custom games would never be accepted in Survival/Tournament by players with "good" stats, just like MGO2. So people would feel forced to play in ranked games to get accurate stats. Especially if they don't know people on MGO. This won't be a problem for me personally but I'm thinking about the community as a whole.
Your kidding me right?

People who play custom lobbies do so for fun, or for an added challenge by either removing or adding stuff, whoever it shouldnt affect stats because you are not playing by the standard rule set or competitive in this case.

There wont be as much elitism as mgo2 because its simple as this, if you can play good in standard matches then you will have good stats and those stats will only reflect the way you play in competitive matches and not overall, its the whole point of why people look at your stats as a reference to how you play, if you suck, then ofcourse its going to be harder for you to find a team, its always been this way in all forms of competitive games.

And who cares if you like playing custom matches, you can still do that, its just not going to benefit you in terms of leveling up, not that that even matters in terms of progression. Not guns to unlock and such.
Well some people want their stats to be registered just for the sake of looking through your stats from time to time. For example me. I played mostly casual on MGO but I still looked at my stats and I got some animal ranks and also my level was accurate to the way I played. People who almost only played non-stats could be level 9 but play like a level 15/16. I want my level to be accurate.

@_se7en_"Now in MGO, if you saw someone level 17 or higher you knew he was a great player (when it wasn't boosted, of course)"

There were great players who was nowhere close to level 17.
Like I said, there was people who mostly played non-stats so they could be level 9 but be really good (quick reaction time, good aim, good teamplaying). These players were good but they weren't available for Survival and Tournament. So basically if you didn't shine in Survival/Tournament you didn't exist on MGO for many. Like MGO was all about prestige LOL. It was so much more and I feel sorry for those who didn't see that.

Level didn't mean anything really. It could mean something. Those who were level 17 legit was obviously good. But it doesn't necessarily mean they were better than let's say a level 15. Personally I considered myself as good. I had quick reaction time, good aim and I was a good teamplayer (aggressive, leader type). But I never made it past level 15 because I played stuff that wasn't effectively getting my level up such as playing as Snake in SNE, fooling around with CQC in normal games and trolling. So stop sounding like a typical MGO2 stats nerd who look up to high level players like they're some kind of Foxhound soldiers or whatever. And realise that the MGO2 levels was accurate to the way people played and skill. Not skill only.
Edited by Danne Smeed, Dec 26 2014, 03:36:49 PM.
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(SGR) SEAN
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Dec 26 2014, 02:46:53 PM
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Dec 23 2014, 06:56:01 PM
The obscure
Dec 23 2014, 04:53:12 PM
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Dec 23 2014, 04:38:19 PM
The free battle lobby, where if you make a custom game it automatically switches to unranked
Worst idea I've seen in a long time.
What if you prefer to only play custom or to do so most of the time?
Then the stats wouldn't be close to accurate. This would only strengthen elitism like people who play alot of custom games would never be accepted in Survival/Tournament by players with "good" stats, just like MGO2. So people would feel forced to play in ranked games to get accurate stats. Especially if they don't know people on MGO. This won't be a problem for me personally but I'm thinking about the community as a whole.
Your kidding me right?

People who play custom lobbies do so for fun, or for an added challenge by either removing or adding stuff, whoever it shouldnt affect stats because you are not playing by the standard rule set or competitive in this case.

There wont be as much elitism as mgo2 because its simple as this, if you can play good in standard matches then you will have good stats and those stats will only reflect the way you play in competitive matches and not overall, its the whole point of why people look at your stats as a reference to how you play, if you suck, then ofcourse its going to be harder for you to find a team, its always been this way in all forms of competitive games.

And who cares if you like playing custom matches, you can still do that, its just not going to benefit you in terms of leveling up, not that that even matters in terms of progression. Not guns to unlock and such.
Well some people want their stats to be registered just for the sake of looking through your stats from time to time. For example me. I played mostly casual on MGO but I still looked at my stats and I got some animal ranks and also my level was accurate to the way I played. People who almost only played non-stats could be level 9 but play like a level 15/16. I want my level to be accurate.

@_se7en_"Now in MGO, if you saw someone level 17 or higher you knew he was a great player (when it wasn't boosted, of course)"

There were great players who was nowhere close to level 17.
Like I said, there was people who mostly played non-stats so they could be level 9 but be really good (quick reaction time, good aim, good teamplaying). These players were good but they weren't available for Survival and Tournament. So basically if you didn't shine in Survival/Tournament you didn't exist on MGO for many. Like MGO was all about prestige LOL. It was so much more and I feel sorry for those who didn't see that.

Level didn't mean anything really. It could mean something. Those who were level 17 legit was obviously good. But it doesn't necessarily mean they were better than let's say a level 15. Personally I considered myself as good. I had quick reaction time, good aim and I was a good teamplayer (aggressive, leader type). But I never made it past level 15 because I played stuff that wasn't effectively getting my level up such as playing as Snake in SNE, fooling around with CQC in normal games and trolling. So stop sounding like a typical MGO2 stats nerd who look up to high level players like they're some kind of Foxhound soldiers or whatever. And realise that the MGO2 levels was accurate to the way people played and skill. Not skill only.
....

If your not playing legitimate games to begin with then your level would be misleading anyway.

With the way im saying it would work, your level would represent how well you play in a competitive environment only, which is what matters.

You can go into custom games and have fun withought any worries, even use it as a training ground, and then go into legitimate matches if you want to play seriously.

Leveling in mgo2

It showed how good you were and how cosistent you were at playing good.
Also if you want to add this to the equation, what group of people you played with, since if you played w lower levels you had to pretty much play perfectly or you would de level.

This system should stick, it gave you something to work toward.
I remember when i was playing before i was really good, and i was stuck at level 13, i was almost to the level where id be cosidered a good player (i didnt know it at the time but yea) and id just keep playing and playing, in my own tsne libby that i would host, trying to improve and get to a higher level, when i got to 15 i thought i was gonna explode... And when i went back down to 14 the next game.. I was angry yes, but i was also more determined to play better.

The thing is, with mgo always encouraging you to play better, the skill of players kept rising to the point where tactics and stealth where a thing of the past, so if a new player would join and the first game they play, they dont even stand 1% of a chance, they will most likely just turn of their console or pc, and just go "yeaaaa, not playing that anymore"
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_se7en_
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Dec 26 2014, 02:46:53 PM


@_se7en_"Now in MGO, if you saw someone level 17 or higher you knew he was a great player (when it wasn't boosted, of course)"

There were great players who was nowhere close to level 17.
Like I said, there was people who mostly played non-stats so they could be level 9 but be really good (quick reaction time, good aim, good teamplaying). These players were good but they weren't available for Survival and Tournament. So basically if you didn't shine in Survival/Tournament you didn't exist on MGO for many. Like MGO was all about prestige LOL. It was so much more and I feel sorry for those who didn't see that.

Level didn't mean anything really. It could mean something. Those who were level 17 legit was obviously good. But it doesn't necessarily mean they were better than let's say a level 15. Personally I considered myself as good. I had quick reaction time, good aim and I was a good teamplayer (aggressive, leader type). But I never made it past level 15 because I played stuff that wasn't effectively getting my level up such as playing as Snake in SNE, fooling around with CQC in normal games and trolling. So stop sounding like a typical MGO2 stats nerd who look up to high level players like they're some kind of Foxhound soldiers or whatever. And realise that the MGO2 levels was accurate to the way people played and skill. Not skill only.

wtf? :D , i fail to see how my quote, which was very simple to understand and which you ended up agreeing to led you to having a rant about MGO elitists that only cared about stats, and, worse of all, sugesting that i think the same way as those people, but ok, i guess :D


i was a level 15 player myself, and i think i never even got to level 16 at any point and i like to think myself as a good teamplayer aswell. But most importantly, i had a lot of fun playing the game, always had friends to play with and was fortunate enough to have an active clan to play in Free Battle ,Survivals , tournaments and goof around. Of course that levels aren't and weren't everything ( and where did i say otherwise? :huh: ) but all i did was giving a practical example between a high level in games like cod (where only matters the amount of time you play) and a high level in games like MGO (where your performance and skill counts) and i happenned to talk about a specific level (17) by chance but yes, being a legitimate level 16, 17 or higher on MGO was indeed indicative of being a very good player, because you always had to work hard to earn that level and keep it and/or improving it . I Know i had to work hard to level up and keep my level even though it wasn't that high so i can imagine how hard it was to stay at a high level while keep playing competitevely in modes like survival and tournaments, etc.




Edited by _se7en_, Dec 26 2014, 06:16:39 PM.
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KingOfNeverland
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i think the level and GP system is a double-edged sword.if the community is small and close like it was on MGO2,good players stand out naturally, and dont really need the system to prove they are good.and then all GP and level does is turn people into elitist pricks who dont allow anyone with a level lower than theirs to play with them,out of fear of harming their own precious numbers.then people who didnt really give a shit and had no qualms about messing around with CQC EX when they got survival games against level 8's you were going to beat anyway(kind of like myself) got screwed over for,you know, trying to have fun with the game.

on the other hand,if the player base turns out to be substantially bigger than on the previous iterations, then something similar to GP and level could be a nice way to differentiate between the players,since you wont often play with the same guy twice,unless he is your clanmate.i play hearthstone nowadays, and rank seems like a perfectly good indicator of how well you are doing,other than the fact that people who have more time to play the game and are as good as you tipically get to legend rank more easily.
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sadistic_greyfox
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Rikitatsu
Dec 26 2014, 12:06:08 PM
Ar2, Run2 in MGO2, a lot of people will stick with the 'Assault' class or whatever they might cook up
Barf, this was the everyman class and made it extremely boring for me and I'm guessing for the majority of players, if we're looking for the install base for mgo2. And yeah classes do Make folks want to play as a team, idk what you're talking about. The only Game i can name for you off the top of my head that doesn't have one and yet folks work together is the ARMA series on PC and mgo is a far cry from that in both tone and action.

Classes like medics and engineers, these are useful team classes, now if KP are just making like "sniper class, heavy and assault classes" without any real objectives to the game that puts them to use well, then yeah, it will suck. Lets be honest though, if they go down the TDM route like mgo2 fell into this game would probably fail from the word go. It needs to change stuff up to be competitive, why else does Battlefield exist and do so well along side cod? offer the things COD cannot offer.

I hope they really are looking at the install base and the opinions from folks who disliked the game (MGO2), there's a reason at one point the highpoint of folks logging in maxed out about 600 players, at some points even 200 on a survival night. the game got to hard for regular folks who just want to hang out after work and have fun.
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(SGR) SEAN
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That also has mostly todo with the fact that not alot of people knew about mgo, when it launched mgo2 barely reached more than 10,000 players

If mgo2 was released NOW with most of its issues fixed and more people knew about it, the game wouldve ended up being much more popular I GUARANTEE it.
But that wont happen
But i also dont see a reason to use a system that doesnt work, the only reason theres "teamwork" in battlefield is because of squad spawning and even then, people would just spawn on you and just do their thing.
Even Tf2 has this, adding classes does very little to promote teamwork.
If you have classes then all that matters is how well you play as that class and not much else
Edited by (SGR) SEAN, Dec 26 2014, 08:50:08 PM.
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Rikitatsu
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sadistic_greyfox
Dec 26 2014, 08:01:38 PM
Rikitatsu
Dec 26 2014, 12:06:08 PM
Ar2, Run2 in MGO2, a lot of people will stick with the 'Assault' class or whatever they might cook up
Barf, this was the everyman class and made it extremely boring for me and I'm guessing for the majority of players, if we're looking for the install base for mgo2. And yeah classes do Make folks want to play as a team, idk what you're talking about. The only Game i can name for you off the top of my head that doesn't have one and yet folks work together is the ARMA series on PC and mgo is a far cry from that in both tone and action.

Classes like medics and engineers, these are useful team classes, now if KP are just making like "sniper class, heavy and assault classes" without any real objectives to the game that puts them to use well, then yeah, it will suck. Lets be honest though, if they go down the TDM route like mgo2 fell into this game would probably fail from the word go. It needs to change stuff up to be competitive, why else does Battlefield exist and do so well along side cod? offer the things COD cannot offer.
You see, my point is: What's the difference between AR2/RUN2 skill set and a hypothetical 'Assault Class'? Nothing, aside from the 'Assault Class' being restrictive.

In every class based MP game, including Battlefield, you'll see that one class is used more than the others. Same way AR2/RUN2 is the more popular choice among MGO2 players (At least, in action-y modes). So going for a class based system will not encourage people take on different roles, most will still choose the class most efficient in shootbang.

I'd argue that MGO2's skills encouraged teamplay more than Battlefield-esque class system ever did, a team member can be assigned a specific role thanks to the very specialized skills. In a BASE match for example, the guy who captures the target and runs chooses the RUN skill, other players use QuarterBack to lob grenades into the bases, and some use Toughness so they won't lose the target if somebody threw a grenade their way.

In TSNE match, a player with QR3 can tip the scales, same goes for someone with the Scanner skill. Not to mention skills like NARC and Mono that reveal enemies locations and share them via SOP.

And it's not something that only works when you play with your friends or clan, I had great teamwork working with Randoms thanks to Pre-Battle text chat.

MGO3 just needs to add more Team Based skills like those and do away with restrictive bullshit like a class system. It doesn't have any advantages worth mentioning over MGO2's system.
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(SGR) SEAN
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In mgo you werent given defined roles, you defined your own roles.
And in survival or tourney it would really show with certain teams, that actually had teamwork
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A Big Crocodile
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The class system is making me pretty nervous as well. I was really going for a shield/handgun playstyle in the next MGO. And if there's no deleveling I'm most likely not gonna play it either. It bothered the fuck out of me how on BF3 the game was riddled with shitty lvl100 colonels and beasting low level alts.
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Rikitatsu
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Dec 26 2014, 08:43:34 PM
In mgo you werent given defined roles, you defined your own roles.
And in survival or tourney it would really show with certain teams, that actually had teamwork
Exactly, I can't count the amount of times we've won against teams that were much superior thanks to clever assigning of skills and roles.

Restricting players doesn't make for better team work.
Edited by Rikitatsu, Dec 26 2014, 08:49:05 PM.
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Actually, BF3 also had classes, but in the end almost everyone played either as support (big guns) or as medics. I almost never saw any recons or engineers.
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The one thing that will annoy me though, and this goes with any game.

Is those "Best Setup" videos on youtube, that encourage the use of certain guns that are not balanced properly, or show certain secrets to games.

Yea some people like that stuff.
And im kinda being a hater for not being in favor of new players knowing what they could use to improve their game...
But in mgo thats what the training lobbies where for... I just... Idk,
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_se7en_
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Dec 26 2014, 08:43:34 PM
In mgo you werent given defined roles, you defined your own roles.
And in survival or tourney it would really show with certain teams, that actually had teamwork
exactly. the individual skills provided for way more teamwork then what class systems do. And that AR2+ Run 2 trend was true in free battle and in random teams but on organized teams and/or good clans, each individual had a role and had specific skills to make the best out of that role
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Dec 26 2014, 08:34:40 PM
MGO3 just needs to add more Team Based skills like those and do away with restrictive bullshit like a class system. It doesn't have any advantages worth mentioning over MGO2's system.
Honestly, this is the best way to go about it. It will add more options all while still letting the player have 100% freedom over customization and play style which is important. Also on the team skills subject, I'm not sure which ones should be added. As long as they aren't overpowering.

We don't want to be restricted by a class system. Everyone should have every weapon available to them at the start of a match like MGO 1 and 2. And if there are weapon points (GMP? DP?) enabled in the match then you need to unlock them mid match by helping your team objective or getting kills to get points.

And everyone should be able to wear whatever they want. No restrictions on gear/clothes to a particular class.
Edited by WaterN-ice, Dec 26 2014, 09:37:39 PM.
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