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| Death Stranding General Discussion | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jun 14 2016, 03:26:51 AM (30,262 Views) | |
| Rogue Agent | Jun 14 2016, 03:26:51 AM Post #1 |
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Occasional News Bot
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Stars Norman Reedus. It's basically a video announcing the title of the game - there's nothing much yet. No gameplay yet.![]() Edited by Rogue Agent, Jun 14 2016, 02:16:52 PM.
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Most Helpful Member award I <3 TOKUGAWA HEAVY INDUSTRIES - credit goes to Tollhouse and Snake Eater
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| The Departed | Dec 24 2016, 08:14:59 PM Post #521 |
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Your friendly neighborhood truck
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antii i was 13 when mgs1 first came out. i didn't think this way for 18 years, else, i wouldn't be a fan. basically, i'm a fan of some of the games, namely the big boss ones, and key word being the gameplay element, for the most part. and none of the stories because they're all mostly exposition, which is the literal worst way to ever progress a story. that's why, whenever movies do the mgs thing, where every single scene is one exposition dump after another with sprinkles of character moments, then no matter how quirky certain characters are, those movies are panned. well, my eyes are wide open. if mgs was really a narrative driven series, then that's one shit-ass series. if it's a quirky stealth action game, that's almost endearing considering how tonally inconsistent and badly written its' stories were, then it's mostly solid despite its' narrative. and the thing is, we're not talking just the genre, but kojima's writing in general. look at the talent on board ds thus far: normal reedus; fairly competent actor with the best cry face ever. mad-eye mikkelsen, an amazing actor and a wicked martial artist. and now, there's rumors of idris elba and kevin durand. if any given one of these had an mgs-esque script? it won't matter how talented they all are, because their talent will to go waste. great actors don't make great stories. kojima could toss in daniel day lewis and two bryan cranston's, but without a competent writer, all this acting talent won't amount to anything more than stunt casting made to accommodate a lackluster script, and that just can't work. unless kojima was taking a shit ton of writing courses during his "vacation," then there's no reason to expect anything more from ds' writing than anything mgs ever had to offer, which was precisely fuck all. |
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awards and such r.i.p. to the coolest dude we'll ever know
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| Antii | Dec 25 2016, 08:30:57 PM Post #522 |
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Nerf herder.
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@ The Departed I was older than you when MGS was released and I didn't understand much of the story myself, I fell in love with the characters and gameplay. I know there's a lot of exposition in these games, but I love the way Kojima constructs these stories. How the twists are paced and so on. The thing that has stuck with me with all the MGS games has been (post MGS1) the stories, the settings and the characters, not the gameplay. In TPP what I I love most the unbelievable details and possibilities in the gameplay, not the story and this is the only MGS game where the story doesn't really resonate with me in any way. People love different things in this franchise and so it is in anything. If you're not a fan of exposition-heavy storytelling and it bothers you a fuck lot, I'm guessing you're not a fan of Chris Nolan's films. I notice the exposition in stuff, but sometimes it bothers me, mostly it just doesn't and I like/hate the whole picture. Edited by Antii, Dec 25 2016, 08:32:14 PM.
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| Ludens | Dec 26 2016, 10:30:36 AM Post #523 |
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I'll keep coming
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Just a reminder, DS is written cooperatively by Kojima and Kenji Yano, who's an award winning, well-respected writer in Japan. that's a big advantage DS has over the MGS games and I'm looking forward to seeing how the story would turn out.
Edited by Ludens, Dec 26 2016, 03:15:25 PM.
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| The Departed | Dec 26 2016, 05:41:35 PM Post #524 |
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Your friendly neighborhood truck
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antii that's not enough for me, because the settings might be okay at times, and the characters might be well rounded, but they aren't full fledged developed characters. they're simply the illusion of developed characters. solid snake isn't developed. what change he goes through in mgs1 comes off as artificial because it hinges on him caring about meryl, and i don't buy that at all anymore. liquid claims snake loves all the killing, but outside of snake saying at one point, "on the battlefield is when i feel alive," what do we get that actually shows us he enjoys killing people? with mgs2, none of the main characters were developed. solidus was dope, but he was waaaaay underdeveloped as a character. that's why he had to give that damn monologue before his final boss, so we actually knew what he was on about. raiden had nothing going for him as a protagonist. snake and octagon were the most well rounded characters of mgs2, but it's not like they changed. they started off as new men, and left as new men. whatever changed them after mgs1, happened off screen. and mgs3? i'm not even gonna comment on how painfully underdeveloped the characters who mattered were. mgs3 was better at establishing a relationship between naked snake and eva, because they're together for a longer period of time and their journey takes place over a longer period of time. but that's not the emotional crux of the story; biggie and the boss is the emotional crux, and it falls flat on its' face, because we get one codec conversation with the boss at the start, and then a lot of talking about how no one can understand biggie and the boss' relationship; something we never truly saw, and never had any reason to give a shit about. the boss might be more endearing than liquid and solidus, but ultimately, she's no different than either of them. all she does is monologue at biggie, and occasionally slap everyone around. nothing that expands this complicated history between her and biggie, and nothing that gives real insight as to why she's doing what she's doing. her entire motivation gets unraveled in one of the longest goddamn pre-final boss monologues in all of mgs. that is not good storytelling or character development. and outside of mgs3, the settings never meant anything to me. i've seen a 'shadow moses' before. and i've seen oil rigs to death. i hated mgs2 for its' setting, and wasn't a fan of mgs1's setting either, especially since it's so short a game. i only liked mgs3's setting because it was good at constantly changing and mixing things up. but it's not like that was the first time i'd seen a jungle or mountain before in a video game. see, that's fine. what boggles my mind is that any of these stories resonate with anyone anymore. for me, tpp's no worse than mgs1 or mgs3. mgs3 might be way more cinematic, but the end result of any mgs story is me not giving a shit about anyone or anything that happened. the only difference is that i like certain characters and certain moments more. for me, no villain is better than the skullster, and no supporting character can top mcfiddler. but outside of a few moments of mgsv's story, i just don't give a shit, because none of these games give me a reason to give a shit. not necessarily. i'm a huge nolan fanboy, but i'm not blind to how exposition heavy his films tend to be, and yes, that does try my patience, especially in the dark knight trilogy, all of which i adore. but see, the reason i actually like nolan and not kojima is because one is infinitely better at developing characters, constructing better dialogue, and much better at world building to show what is going on. inception was one of my favorite films in years, and i tolerate the heavy exposition because nolan and his brother know how to show us what the exposition is eluding to. take cobb talking about what happened to mal. that's a fairly long winded moment, but it's not just leo talking at ellen page. we see him and mal building this world, we see her changing, and finally, we see the end result of what transpires. it's a balance of telling and showing, with a stronger tipping point of showing. i'd much rather they show way more than they tell, but what they do is good enough to make me overlook how heavy the exposition rests on things. that's not the case with kojima in the least. with every monologue, we don't see anything, outside of the occasional moving concept art or b-roll footage. we don't see this world everyone's talking about. we're always focused on the present, and all too often, there's nothing in the present to show us what anyone is talking about. so all we have is just people talking, and unlike inception or the dark knight trilogy, the information isn't nearly as well written or compelling. it's often far more dense and far more convoluted. so, it's not even like the exposition is all that interesting to begin with, most times. skull face's long ass monologue is interesting because it's personal and well written, but i still can't get fully into it because i know for a fact that it can be cut down to at least half. see, that's the other thing that separates kojima from nolan. he is in desperate need of an editor, because most scenes he writes don't need to be as long as they are. and with mgs1, it was infinitely worse because people repeated same iterations of the exact same lines literally seconds later. like snake saying he's counting on octagon, octagon thanking him, and snake saying he believed in him and octagon thanking him for that too. that shit grinds me gears like a motherfuck. it takes me out of the moment and just makes me cringe, because it's so painfully obvious that this isn't final draft material, and here it is not only in the final game, but getting praised, which baffles me to no end. so, to say that the series is strong not for its' gameplay, but its' narrative and writing, to me, feels fictitious, because objectively speaking, the writing is not strong enough to carry a franchise. it's definitely distinct, but for the wrong reasons. most people when you ask them about mgs, will look back on its' convoluted plot, not its' thought provoking messages. and that's not say these games don't have anything to say because they all do. but a strong message needs a strong story to complement said message and drive it home, and mgs, as a series, doesn't have that. not when the actual scripts are so unpolished, the stories are so heavily reliant on needing to be told at us, and the characters around said stories are ultimately so underdeveloped. that's why i stopped liking these stories, and why i'm not the least bit hopeful for deaf stranding's story. i'm excited for ds because i'm really curious if its' gameplay will be half as good or dynamic as mgsv, because if it is, then i'm sold immediately. but for all the weird shit the trailers have going for them, i see nothing that even remotely informs on what kind of story we're in for, and frankly, as of now, i see no reason to trust kojima will suddenly become a competent writer. ludens i can't get excited about that because i can't find yano's resume anywhere and his imdb page either won't load properly or hasn't been updated. plus, i don't know how what him writing cooperatively with kojima means, if he's just helping him with the script or actually hammering the ideas and planning together. as it death stands, maddy mads saying ds basically didn't make much sense to him when it was explained to him, is a bit of a red flag for me, personally. |
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awards and such r.i.p. to the coolest dude we'll ever know
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| Ludens | Dec 26 2016, 07:33:35 PM Post #525 |
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I'll keep coming
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Yano's known as Hitori Nojima, his pen name but there's not much info about him sadly since most (if not all) of his books aren't translated to English. what I've read about him though, is that he's a very capable writer and has won many awards so that's something. He's credited as the writer of the game alongside Kojima in both trailers so I think it's safe to assume that he has a pretty big hand in writing the script. regarding what Mads said, I don't think it'd be a concern tbh. he said that he only had a brief look at some parts of the script and didn't understand much of it, and he has to see more of it to understand it completely. In a recent interview, Norman Reedus praised the game's script and described it as "very intelligent" even though he too doesn't know the whole thing since Kojima's keeping them in the dark about some parts of the plot. anyway, it doesn't really sound bad to me, especially when the guys working with Kojima's team speak so highly of the project. the interview is in French and I've read the translation, I'll link it when I find the article. Edited by Ludens, Dec 26 2016, 09:28:52 PM.
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| Antii | Dec 26 2016, 09:48:58 PM Post #526 |
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Nerf herder.
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I never said the characters were well developed. I simply meant that they were interesting and memorable. To me at least. This is why I like them and why the cast of MGS1 might be my favorite cast of the whole series. Especially when compared to other game characters of the time. Nowadays it's different as you know and character development is pretty much waited for in most character driven games. One of the reasons why THE LAST OF US is one of my favorite games I've ever played is because of the main duo and how well they were written and how their arcs are developed throughout the 20 or so hour journey. Other than those two, I can't remember many other characters from that game, but I still think it's a masterpiece. No game is perfect to me, no game has "it all". This is because of gamers are individuals and different gamers like different things. As a whole I love the MGS series. There's great stuff in all the games I've played (except PORTABLE OPS, I hated that shit) and they each made an impact on me in different ways. You and I simply enjoy different things and put weight on different aspects. I'm more often a "feel guy". No matter how big problems eg. a certain movie has, I still might enjoy it immensely for other reasons. BLADE RUNNER is one of my favorite movies of all time and that one does not have a great script or well developed characters. It's the world, aesthetics and atmosphere that I love about that film. I have my reasons why I love the games of the Metal Gear saga. I can't wait to hear and see more of DEATH STRANDING to be honest. I'm very intrigued by what little we have gotten so far. I have no need to get people love or even like Kojima's writing or style or anything else for that matter. I just really enjoy his games, that's all. Edited by Antii, Dec 26 2016, 10:28:04 PM.
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| Ishmael Snake | Dec 27 2016, 08:27:26 PM Post #527 |
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call me Ishmael Snake
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Speaking of gameplay i would like this game to start when Norman awake at the beach and i see the gameplay to be like you're the first primitive man on earth and you need to use whatever you find things like sticks and ropes made from something, throwing stones, swimming to catch fishes and eat them stuff like guns should be used later in the game if you are exploring different world or the times. |
Good luck kiefersnake ! "Vic" Boss![]() | |
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| Ef9 o shea | Dec 28 2016, 01:44:24 AM Post #528 |
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Hadoken
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I really just want gameplay footage |
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| Doakes | Dec 30 2016, 09:22:19 AM Post #529 |
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Likewise, gameplay is all that matter to me. If the core gameplay is as outlandish as the latest trailer was, and fighting Skeletal Soldiers is somehow distinct, I will be quite intrigued and eager. But this being a Hideo Kojima game, I know with certainty what we've seen thus far is an indicator of excellent trailers, not necessarily excellent stories. I've said that a few times, but I want to make it clear, that doesn't mean I don't think Death Stranding will be a bad game. I've been a fan of Metal Gear Solid for almost twenty years, and at no point was it ever REALLY because of the story. And MGSV was proof, for me personally, that KojiPro knows how to develop a truly excellent game, and with Next Generation Hardware no longer limited by Last Generation Compatibility, I'm very eager to see what these guys come up with, and if it's as fluid and responsive as MGSV was. Mainly, I just hope it isn't a glorified Third Person Shooter, and I wish there was more to go on than vague comparisons to other games. Without that information, I can't get excited frankly. I'm mainly eager for information. And that information will dictate if this is a game I feel is worth my excitement or not. |
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| trimegadon | Jan 4 2017, 11:47:14 PM Post #530 |
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all out.
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Ragnarox with another insightful video analysis on DS. HomoLudens or: Kojima's evolution of mankind Also happy to see a post i made about the relativity theory being connected to DS, is also acknowledged by him. |
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| Silent Assassin | Feb 4 2017, 01:57:33 PM Post #531 |
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ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
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Sony giving Kojima 100% creative freedom; Sequel not ruled out |
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| big_boss1988 | Feb 4 2017, 03:53:41 PM Post #532 |
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I Am The Hype
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And Kojima says that every game he developed was on schedule and there was always a deadline... and he always met the deadline. Really?! |
![]() Spoiler: click to toggle MGSF PEACE
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| CIA | Feb 4 2017, 04:36:05 PM Post #533 |
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Mr gorbachev tear down that text wall. Anyone think death stranding will have dlc and micro transactions? |
![]() Departed: I hate MGS 1 because I'm old. Forum Bling
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| big_boss1988 | Feb 4 2017, 06:31:34 PM Post #534 |
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I Am The Hype
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I think it will have both. |
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| Commodus | Feb 4 2017, 06:39:14 PM Post #535 |
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Jail Guard
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I think Kojima is going to really use the PS4 speaker system to mess around with players. Having voices whisper at you, to make you wonder if Mads' character has possessed you, too, would be right up his alley. But what really intrigues me is the possibility of using the internal clock. MGS3 was meant to have a boss battle lasting two weeks, MGS4 was supposed to let Snake's beard grow over time. I wouldn't be shocked if the baby actually ends up having a lifespan, and grows older the more you play. |
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| big_boss1988 | Feb 4 2017, 08:18:48 PM Post #536 |
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I Am The Hype
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I would be. In fact, I really wish it doesn't happen because we're definitely getting a new nanomachines type somehow! |
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| The Departed | Feb 4 2017, 08:35:00 PM Post #537 |
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Your friendly neighborhood truck
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I won't speculate what gameplay features exist until we actually see the game in action, because Kojima recently said he didn't want it to be too similar to that Horizon game from Guerrilla. What I want from Maddy Mads is for him to be a recurring threat, and one we encounter in Boss form periodically, not just in cutscenes. Anytime Normal encounters an enemy, I want it to be playable. No more CQCing twelve guys st once while I sit here wondering why the game doesn't like me. |
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awards and such r.i.p. to the coolest dude we'll ever know
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| Commodus | Feb 4 2017, 08:36:54 PM Post #538 |
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Jail Guard
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Oh, God! Don't mention the N-word! I think Kojima will take a more mystical approach. Mads' character, to me, looks more like a necromancer than anything else - and whilst Kojima has talked at length about politics and war and genetics, the theme of faith and spirituality is one he's never really touched on. For a creative person like him, the idea of demons and raising the dead and all the moral questions about it must be quite tantalising! |
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| CIA | Feb 5 2017, 12:38:21 PM Post #539 |
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i hope they keep CQC stuff for death stranding. jamming on R2 and annihilating everyone was my favorite part in MGSV. can you imagine CQC with babies factored in?
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![]() Departed: I hate MGS 1 because I'm old. Forum Bling
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| solidsnoop29 | Feb 12 2017, 02:12:37 PM Post #540 |
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Twitter: @SolidSnoop29, Skype: SolidSnoop29, Twitch: SolidSnoop101
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Since the main character or mascot of Kojima Productions is Ludens, and since it's been so heavily linked to the way this game will be played I'm wondering whether the themes of ludology comes into play in this game? The argument that narrative will not matter in the games, and the story wont be as heavy as the metal gear series was. It's more about being creative in game-play as such and the characters doing most of the story telling. It's more about actions and events. Maybe I'm thinking too much into this lol. I have a feeling we will start of with the stick and the rope, and then technology will change everything depending on the time / era we are in, the new technology, weapons will play a part of hanging the whole game around. In other words it will be about making the use of the new weapons etc in a way the changes events or the whole story somehow? Edited by solidsnoop29, Feb 12 2017, 02:31:40 PM.
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![]() "This world will become one - I have found the way. Race, Tribal affiliations, National borders. Even our faces will be irrelevant. The world that The Boss envisioned will finally become a reality. And it will make mankind whole again...". V HAS COME TO Meme x Gene X Scene | |
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