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Why are they using Codec even when they are facing each other?
Topic Started: Nov 15 2017, 01:20:23 AM (638 Views)
Psajdak
Light Infantry
I mean, I know it's explained cause eavesdroping, but they still talk just as loud as when they talk normally.

Cutscenes cost more?
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Weedle_McHairybug
Hi-Tech Soldier
Psajdak
Nov 15 2017, 01:20:23 AM
I mean, I know it's explained cause eavesdroping, but they still talk just as loud as when they talk normally.

Cutscenes cost more?
Going by the Document of Metal Gear Solid 2's script, they literally communicate through nanomachines, meaning that, while communicating, their lips aren't moving nor are they emanating any sound. It's sort of like Telepathy, only in that case, you technically can't even hear them in the background.
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Psajdak
Light Infantry
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpJH921NQj0

Their lips ARE moving.
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ballisticola
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Still we carry you.

Psajdak
Nov 15 2017, 01:46:50 AM
What do you mean? They are either literally speaking to each other or through nanos. There are other scenes where we see him speaking and his lip don't move. There aren't any scenes like that here.

And it has nothing to do with space, because the cutscenes are not stored but generated on the fly.
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Psajdak
Light Infantry
For example?
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ballisticola
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Still we carry you.

Psajdak
Nov 15 2017, 02:48:16 AM
For example?
When Raiden first meets Snake.
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Weedle_McHairybug
Hi-Tech Soldier
In case anyone is still in doubt, here's what the Plant Chapter Script for the Document of Metal Gear Solid 2 states:

Quote:
 
Camera on Raiden and Pliskin. Raiden returns the M4 to Pliskin, who reloads
the weapon.

Raiden:
So youíre saying that VR training is some kind of mind control.

Raiden is needlessly aggressive; he feels that his qualifications as a
soldier have been belittled by Pliskin. At that moment, the Colonel checks in
on the Codec. Raiden takes the call, back turned towards Pliskin. Pliskin
cannot hear the dialogue since communication between the Colonel and Raiden
is a silent, nanotech-based exchange.

Colonel:
(OFF) Raiden ? Whatís going on!
Raiden:
The Alpha team from Navy SEAL 10 is dead -- (remembering Pliskin), no
a single survivor.
Pliskin:
The kidís wired with nanomachines.


You can find it here: https://www.gamefaqs.com/ps2/914506-the-document-of-metal-gear-solid-2/faqs/27630

Or if you have the game, you can just plop it in and see for yourself.
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Doakes
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The codec screens are just visuals for our sake. A solid example of the codec in use would be the scene when Raiden makes contact with Ames. He tells Raiden to switch over to nanocommunication, and when we cut to Ocelot, they're just staring at each other like goons and not saying a word, or moving their lips.

It's all complete hogwash, but there you have it.
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ballisticola
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Still we carry you.

I'd rather that than the virtual nothing of MGS4.
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Mission 46: The Painful Truth
The Science of Metal Gear: Who is the dominant Snake?

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Cleme201101
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I think that the real reason is that it is way longer and more expensive to animate cut scenes where you have to animate body language than to just animating their faces.

The canon, in-game reason is nanomachines.
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To4oo4
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Jail Guard
Yeah, it would be harder to animate body language than facial movements. And by extension more expensive.
~T2
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ballisticola
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To4oo4
Jan 7 2018, 03:40:03 PM
Yeah, it would be harder to animate body language than facial movements. And by extension more expensive.
The whole game used motion capture, it would have been easy. And there's only so many animations for sitting next to someone :D
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To4oo4
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Jail Guard
I forgot about motion capture for a second.
~T2
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A Big Crocodile
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Filthy casuals

Eavesdropping, ofcourse.

But seriously, even though MOCAP is better in conveying realistic animations than hand-made ones, it's still hella epensive, and the set-up is quite tedious as well.
Edited by A Big Crocodile, Jan 8 2018, 02:35:34 PM.
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KingOfNeverland
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Weedle_McHairybug
Nov 15 2017, 01:32:45 PM
In case anyone is still in doubt, here's what the Plant Chapter Script for the Document of Metal Gear Solid 2 states:

Quote:
 
Camera on Raiden and Pliskin. Raiden returns the M4 to Pliskin, who reloads
the weapon.

Raiden:
So youíre saying that VR training is some kind of mind control.

Raiden is needlessly aggressive; he feels that his qualifications as a
soldier have been belittled by Pliskin. At that moment, the Colonel checks in
on the Codec. Raiden takes the call, back turned towards Pliskin. Pliskin
cannot hear the dialogue since communication between the Colonel and Raiden
is a silent, nanotech-based exchange.

Colonel:
(OFF) Raiden ? Whatís going on!
Raiden:
The Alpha team from Navy SEAL 10 is dead -- (remembering Pliskin), no
a single survivor.
Pliskin:
The kidís wired with nanomachines.


You can find it here: https://www.gamefaqs.com/ps2/914506-the-document-of-metal-gear-solid-2/faqs/27630

Or if you have the game, you can just plop it in and see for yourself.
Surprised you don't think it's because the game is anti american and nihilistic.
mgs player since '99.country of origin:portugal.
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Weedle_McHairybug
Hi-Tech Soldier
KingOfNeverland
Jan 8 2018, 03:05:57 PM
Weedle_McHairybug
Nov 15 2017, 01:32:45 PM
In case anyone is still in doubt, here's what the Plant Chapter Script for the Document of Metal Gear Solid 2 states:

Quote:
 
Camera on Raiden and Pliskin. Raiden returns the M4 to Pliskin, who reloads
the weapon.

Raiden:
So youíre saying that VR training is some kind of mind control.

Raiden is needlessly aggressive; he feels that his qualifications as a
soldier have been belittled by Pliskin. At that moment, the Colonel checks in
on the Codec. Raiden takes the call, back turned towards Pliskin. Pliskin
cannot hear the dialogue since communication between the Colonel and Raiden
is a silent, nanotech-based exchange.

Colonel:
(OFF) Raiden ? Whatís going on!
Raiden:
The Alpha team from Navy SEAL 10 is dead -- (remembering Pliskin), no
a single survivor.
Pliskin:
The kidís wired with nanomachines.


You can find it here: https://www.gamefaqs.com/ps2/914506-the-document-of-metal-gear-solid-2/faqs/27630

Or if you have the game, you can just plop it in and see for yourself.
Surprised you don't think it's because the game is anti american and nihilistic.
The person asked why they didn't make sound via the Codec, I explained the answer to him per the script. It didn't seem like the place to bring that up. Maybe if it were a thread critiquing MGS2 or overall discussing what the game was like in general, I'd bring it up.
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Example
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Jail Guard
Ever noticed how time always stops whenever the codec is being used?
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sadistic_greyfox
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Midnight Leader

If we're going by nanomachines for communications, it's not far to believe that communication would be pretty much instantaneous since you're using thoughts rather than the speed of speech. much like 2 computers communicating with each other. It's kinda trippy to think about human's communicating with the speed of computers but i mean Nanos are basically GOD in the series.
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El Psy Kongroo
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We never lost control.
I think it was partially because mocapping all of that is expensive, and partially because there are only so many ways you can make a scene of two people talking visually interesting. Each game kind of dealt with it in their own way, I guess. MGS1 and 3 tended to revert to using stock, prerendered footage, while MGS4 played those weird slideshows or let you mess around with the MK II.
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Novitch
Knight
Since the game has soo much conversations, it would be a drag to choreograph all of them, thats why they invented the "eavesdropping" thing imo.
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